MediaWiki talk:Sidebar

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The sidebar seems to act somewhat weird. From time to time, it just shows as the default version (with no useful links whatsoever), and stays like that for a couple of minutes or so, even though MediaWiki:Sidebar itself looks perfectly fine. That's probably some weird MediaWiki bug (or maybe the database got desynchronized or corrupted?), but I thought I'd make you guys aware of that, in case you haven't already noticed. --KFYatek 14:24, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

I noticed that as well, but I thought it was page and not time-based. Than again, that'd probably be even more awkward... --BrickBreak 14:25, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

Contents

Tiro Finale

Note, I would not include Tiro Finale as a separate game. It was designed as a promo game for the PSP game. --randomanon 09:23, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

Hmm, I think it make sense to put on a sidebar because it's a game with separate goal from PSP one, what do you think? --0x99 09:27, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
Nevermind, it doesn't even works. (/facepalm) --0x99 09:30, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
It really is a sub game to it because it borrows much of the same content from the PSP game. The difference being is the PSP game is an RPG dungeon with VN elements and Tiro Finale is a simple mini-game app where you attack and defeat witches. They even have it so you play Tiro Finale to unlock content related to the PSP game. That's why we've kept it on the same page. I'd also suggest adding (PSP) to Portable as many people call it that. --randomanon 09:34, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
Now that I say it, we may end up putting Tiro Finale on a separate subpage, linking to the Portable (PSP) main page, because of space issues. I suspect the PSP game will have a big expansion in content soon once the game's out. --randomanon 09:38, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
I'm thinking of reorganizing stuffs into Portals since we have more non-anime stuff more than when we started. (more on that later) --0x99 09:54, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
I think the sidebar should simply be a list of pages that cover official games, not counting subpages. (What about the web browser mmo?) Once an English patch is out, the PSP game will probably need subpages split off. Shorter entries like the iP application could fit on a misc. games/apps page, but a games portal would deal with that. "Portal" is pretty vague, but does this mean, for example, Characters gets split up, "X in the game/manga/movie" gets pulled out of X's main character page, and each portal would have a characters page containing all of and only the medium specific stuff? KM 10:32, 14 March 2012 (UTC)
Ah, completely forgot about Online. Adding it. For more info on portal stuff, see Talk:Main Page#Wiki reorganization --0x99 10:38, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

Comments on Re-Org

I'll be frank. I really really x1000 prefer the old sidebar navigation. It wasn't perfect but I could find things much much easier. The new one just doesn't make sense to me at all. The main thing is I want access to the anime links wherever I am surfing on the site. I'm resorting to doing searches or going constantly back to the main page to refer to "episode 10" or "characters." Why things like "Glossary" and "Events" have direct links from the sidebar, I don't understand, nor does "Contents" grouping or selections chosen for it make sense to me. Again, I really prefer to see manga and games separated and not glomped into one "Series" category.

If you want simple and short, here's what I'd like to see:

  • Anime, with at a minimum, sublinks to episodes and characters subpages. On another note, I don't think you need to separate characters from witches for the anime. It's fine to separate by medium but it's inconvenient to have them separated from one another for the anime. I like to see the full list of them together.
  • Manga category. Sublinks to each manga is optional. If space is premium, it's not necessary to list out all three. Although I'd rather see sublinks dropped out of Community or Toolbox or "Random Page" (do we really need that?) instead.
  • Official Games category. Again, sublinks are optional for space.
  • I want a direct link back to Products. The grouping header to me doesn't matter, but Documents and Materials belong with it. I'm fine if you put them back into one link "Documents" if space is an issue.
  • I think you can drop things like Glossary, Notes or Runes and instead link Madoka Magica Articles and add those links to that page. To me, a comprehensive page like this makes sense to link on a sidebar, and is more useful than three separate links to individual pages. Plus it conserves space.

When navigating this site, because there's so much content, it really helps to have a useful sidebar. At the moment, as well as I know the site, it's become onerous to get to where I want. Please, if you don't agree with my suggestions, at least change it back to the old one. I'd be much happier with that then it is currently. At least in the interim, until you finalize what you want to change.

Let me give you an example of what I'm talking about. Let's say I'm somewhere on the site and I want to find the anime page for Gisela. In the past, I could click on the "Character" sidebar then click on "Gisela"...two clicks. Now, I have to click on the main page, then "Characters", then "Madoka Magica witches", then "Gisela"...four clicks. It's why I end up using search. I don't think I should have to go through all that to get to a major page.

I also don't like that everything is being presented as though it's the same level as the anime. I understand recent traffic may favor something other than the anime, but the anime is still the focal point of the fanbase, e.g. the anime is the basis of everything in the franchise, and each spin-off game or manga isn't so important that it should be linked at the same level. I myself created the Mobage page for example, but I don't think it ought to be treated on par with the anime. Plus, we're going to get movies and probably keep getting new manga, games and other spin-off material, so it'll be unwieldy if each gets its own link/portal whatever. It makes the most sense to me and offers flexibility to have the following categories:

  • Anime (movies we can leave off for now, but incorporate later under anime...the fanbase will almost certainly consider them equivalent in canon)
    • Episodes
    • Characters
  • Manga
    • Three possible options here, depending on space. One, have it link to Manga portal page with links to all three (basically, no sublevels). Two, list all three but have them roll-up. Three, list them as "Madoka Magica" and "Manga Spin-Offs" with the latter have links to Oriko and Kazumi. This will be good with expansion in case there's manga related to the movie (which would go in the former category) or new spin-offs (the latter category)
  • Official Games (3 at the moment).
    • Three possible options here, depending on space. One, have it link to Game portal page with links to all three (no sublevels. Two, list all three but have them roll-up. Three, list them as "Madoka Magica" and "Other Games" with the former having links to the Portable and Online (which seem to both be somewhat more to do with the franchise, given promotion and production staff & seiyuu level involvement) and the latter having link to Mobage (which feels more like a spin-off). This will handle expansion as I have a feeling there will be more games in the future (Portable sold very well, ranked 3rd in its category the first week of sales FYI).

Then other categories as they make sense, like:

  • Supporting Materials (things like Documents, Merchandise, Products would go under here)
    • I would say don't include sublevels (make a page with links to each), roll up the sublevels or if we are keeping it limited, only include Products and Documents. Merchandise is less important as you can find things like that going to any vendor site and searching on Madoka Magica.
  • Community (things like articles, theories, events, fanworks and threads would go under here).
    • I would say don't include sublevels (make a page with links to each), roll up the sublevels or if we are keeping it limited, only include Articles (it already has a link to the theories page and we can create links on there to things like the Glossary, Notes, Runes, etc. which is all sort of the same kind of fan analysis...in fact maybe we can rename it to Analysis, Fan Analysis etc. something more descriptive than Articles), Fanworks and Threads. I suppose you could throw in "Events" in there though I don't think it's as of much interest as the others.
  • Toolbox as currently listed
    • However you want to do it, I imagine most people don't use anything but upload file from it. I rather see direct sublinks sacrificed here if possible versus the other categories. I also think you can get rid of "Random Page" to save space. I don't think many people use it and it doesn't have much value.

This is what makes the most intuitive sense to me and how I for one personally use the site. --randomanon 12:16, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm on a train and probably won't be able to proper reply to this until later today, but given sidebar is now collapsible (i.e. no more space constraint) how would you reorganize it? (I think you can only expand-by-default the first one. I disabled it because it led to disappearing sidebar prior to MW1.18 upgrade. Let's see if it happens again.) Content reorganization is not only about traffic pattern and I agree that Madoka is still the focal point of the fanbase, some content do live on its own now, so it no longer make sense to keep them under the anime. It's easier to manage what is canon and what is not this way too (will add later) --0x99 11:41, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
OK, thanks, I went ahead and revised my wishlist above to give maximum flexibility on how to organize it. I also listed in terms of priority of which I'd like to see direct sublinks under (anime #1), followed by manga etc.
If it needs to be reduced further, I would suggest combining:
Manga/Games (Again, Series doesn't properly explain the category...the anime itself is a series for example whereas the games are not)
  • Manga - page with sublinks to the three manga
  • Games - page with sublinks to the three game
It's possible too we can combine supporting materials with community, although I don't think those really fit together as well. --randomanon 12:16, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
OK, first attempt. What do you think? I still want to make some clear separation between series so it is easily expansible (so Kazumi contents or Portable contents could be break into multiple pages with a clear relation between each other) although some special treatment to the main anime series is OK, so now Madoka Magica section linked to everything in each of its subsection. I'm in no way support creating portal page for all minor series, but it make sense to do so when the page has enough content to do so (e.g. Madoka Magica Portable)
For global characters page, I have a plan for it. Stay tuned... --0x99 13:45, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
It definitely looks much better, I'm happy with it. I could completely live with this. I did notice "Merchandises" is mispelled, it should be "Merchandise." I do think it and Products belong under Supporting Materials as they are all items people can buy related to the franchise, be it magazines, BDs, figma or whatnot...we just happen to have some translations and such thrown in. I also added the Glossary, Runes and Notes pages to the "Articles" page. I feel they're related in being fanmade analysis, though I made sure to feature those three prominently, as I do consider them a level above the other analyses. Articles is fine where it is, though categorically it seems to fit better under Community and then you can use it to replace "Runes" and "Glossary" to save some space. If you prefer to keep it as is out of personal preference though, I don't mind. I can find things that I want now and that's all I care about.
On another note regarding the Characters Page, is it possible we can still include all of them on one page like we have, but trim it down quite a bit so it's not so ridiculously long? For example, if an anime character or witch is used in another medium, just list the name like we do for "Supporting Characters." Only use images for new characters introduced in that medium, like the new Portable Game witches. And we can make the images smaller to save space. The reason I suggest it is it's convenient to be able to see all the characters and witches regardless of source. --randomanon 14:04, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
Note: The Merchandise and Runes links are broke --randomanon 14:19, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
OK, I've made few more alternations. I think Merchandise and Products belong under Anime title since I would like these two pages live under series rather than one page fits all. Kazumi and Portable clearly needs its own products page for example (e.g. Kazumi has Toranoana's special novel or Portable has two packaging, one official strategy book coming, and possible PSN version, DLC etc. in the future).
For characters page I've made a rough design over at User:0x99/Characters. I think we might be able to avoid duplication with <includeonly></includeonly> tag (which limit what gets transcludes into a page) and still have a separate characters page for each series this way. --0x99 14:20, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
OK, I saw the links are fixed and I think from what I understand the Character page change sounds good. The reason I suggested Merchandise and Products fit under Supporting Materials is they currently contain more than items for anime...they list manga, games, etc. and they overlap with Other Media too, which includes links to BDs, game, manga and the same official publications as the Product page. They're all interrelated. Is it really necessary to have a separate products page for something like the Portable game, when there's only two different editions? I mean so far it's been a couple different editions here and there for a manga or game, not a serious amount of merchandise being produced specific to a non-anime source. --randomanon 14:32, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
Kazumi has at least 3 releases (and two single page paper novel which IMHO worth writing about in Products page), PSP currently has two but strategy book release is next month so that's three... I don't know, keeping them separate will make it easier to expand them later on (i.e. we could list all shop specials that way). Current products page kind of bury away anything non-Madoka out of the page. --0x99 14:45, 28 March 2012 (UTC)
Alright then. --randomanon 14:50, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Feedback on New Characters Page

Moved to Talk:Characters#Feedback on New Characters Page

Battle Pentagram

Please add Madoka Magica - The Battle Pentagram under Official Games. - Prima 09:08, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Film section?

Is it possible a Film or Movie section coukd be added? Something like:

  • Films
    • Madoka Magica Movie|Beginnings and Eternal
    • The Rebellion Story|Rebellion

--Universalperson 10:08, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Taruto Magica -> Tart Magica

A mistake introduced by my part. Please correct base on offical title. - Prima 23:51, 13 May 2014 (UTC)

Taruto Magica Cast in Color.jpeg

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