Talk:Saimoe 2011

Well this is an unexpected page to see on this wiki. If you enjoy this tournament and wanted to post about it that's cool but if you're doing it because you think Madoka will win this, I think you'll be disappointed. Odds are none of the Madoka characters will win this because luck and politics aside, I don't think they're seen as the most moe by Japan. I can't say I personally mind it since I enjoy following this for amusement, although it's not something I really relate to Madoka since I started following it back when Nanoha was a big contender. --randomanon 13:31, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Even if they don't win, it's likely that they'll enjoy a good run, although, since it's single elimination, it will be highly dependent on the luck of the draw (note: I didn't even knew about this tourney until I saw this, and I am amazed by the depth, including the witches and ep12 Puellae). We have two preliminary round winners and Walpurgis just barely missed the cut (although how anyone would consider that thing moe is beyond me), so the remaining main characters are almost guaranteed in the main lot, with Junko and, to a lesser degree, Hitomi having a decent shot.
Props to KM for the page. --BrickBreak 14:37, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Apparantly this is a big deal in otakusphere every year. Are characters only allowed in a single preliminary? If so, can we also get a list of already eliminated puella-magis somewhere? Also, where's viking-kun? She's moe as fuck. - Prima 16:24, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

It's all covered in the links. Just don't get it confused with International Saimoe which is different. Saimoe has been around a long time. It's big and while moe is serious it's also done tongue-in-cheek, which is why you get so many votes for things like background characters. It's tradition for people to gang up and vote out top contenders like Homura Akemi before they get that far, so don't get your hopes up. --randomanon 16:57, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

They're allowed into one match in the first set of preliminaries, and some of the ones that don't qualify there get into a second set of preliminaries. Eliminated list added. However, there seems to be an error:

Patricia @ Puella Magi Madoka Magica: <<委員長の魔女＠魔法少女まどか☆マギカ>> round 3

Patricia @ Puella Magi Madoka Magica: <<パトリシア（委員長の魔女）＠魔法少女まどか☆マギカ>> round 12

I'm working from translations so can somebody who understands everything on the official Japanese site confirm that this is what it looks like, and Patricia is in two groups? Also, a Madoka character is going to win this year. All the talk of sniping only strengthens defenses against it, and the competition is limited, with the toughest rivals being a coupe of harems and all of the veteran factions out or fading. Charlotte isn't flat enough, so if we can get rid of Kuroneko and Menma, it's over. KM 17:58, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

You ever seen the winners list for Saimoe? [1]. Look at the girls who win. The only Madoka character that comes close to fitting the profile is Madoka Kanami. The problem is she doesn't get enough focus in the anime to be really beloved or perceived as exceptionally moe. Also, notice what popular characters you don't see. Do you really think Asuza was the most popular girl from K-ON? No, Mio is, but she never makes it that far because she gets sniped down. That may happen to Homura. Also, Bake sold like crazy and before Madoka, Haruhi was the most discussed anime on 2ch. But you don't see them doing well. In the end, I don't think Madoka is going to win because the characters are simply not perceived as the most moe by the definition used in the tournament. This is not a character popularity contest. Adding: Also, notice that some of the winners are from anime that weren't airing that year. Serious contenders are from prior year anime as well. --randomanon 18:02, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Prior years have to have some sort of new appearance to get into the tournament, so aside from K-ON, so there's just Misaka, who was only 3rd in her prelim. Azusa is better liked than Mio after the second season, and it wasn't sniping when the Azusa-Mio-Misaka match had Mio get ignored. Which characters do you expect to win? KM 18:43, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Not really, Mio's been the most popular in online and magazine (NewType) character polls, as well as character product sales. And she definitely does get sniped, it's been openly talked about on 2ch. Not that I ever thought she'd win anyways, Mio doesn't fit the winner profile. Also, let me clarify about prior season anime: K-ON first season aired in 2009, enters tourney in 2009, wins in 2010. Lucky Star aired in 2007 and enters tourney in 2007, wins in 2008. See what I'm saying there about current year/season not being the only serious competition? The way this contest is set up, expecting anyone to win is a big mistake or even how far they'll make it. Two leading popular characters could end up pairing up early and the more popular character could lose due to a vote faction block. This is why I said in my first post that if you're posting this page expecting Madoka to win, you'll probably be disappointed. If you did this page simply because you like Saimoe a lot, that's different, although again I don't see as Madoka related and I'm not sure how you'll feel if this page turns out showing they lose. Do you want to still keep it on the wiki, even if that happens? --randomanon 19:13, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

I leave speculah up when it turns out to be wrong, although it will be a moot point in this case. Contestants gaining strength in their second year makes more sense, but an actual character has to pull it off. Misaka's a 3rd year, and Angel Beats is looking weak and only had one cour. KM 20:14, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Mm, OK. I respect your confidence even if I don't share it. Also, you're overlooking some strong contenders, just so you know. --randomanon 21:05, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

I'll tell you one thing, though: whatever factors affect it, a single elimination tourney is still a single elimination tourney, which means anything can happen. It will greatly depend on the luck of the draw, given that the draw will affect both the chances of one char going through AND the chances of it getting sniped. --BrickBreak 01:52, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

Correct, that's one of my points. That's why "expect to win" is not a good bet to make. --randomanon 01:58, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

That's no fun, though. When you know it's a trap, it's time to make a forceful penetration. KM 03:59, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

Ha. Well, gotta thank you for introducing this to me, because it is sure as hell going to be fun to follow. Took some time to check, and so far, every favorite of mine's through (hey, forgive me, I'm not a one-anime man.... and to be honest, if we ever get a Madoka vs Panty&Stocking showdown, I really dunno), except Black Rock Shooter (and Roberta from Black Lagoon, but she's the opposite of moe without the glasses). But this goes back to what I said earlier... even if it's only Japan, popularity is still the biggest factor. Just looking at Kyouko's bracket, look at who she beat: Mio from Nichijou in tenth, and she's moe as fuck (hell, every character is); Ryuuko from Denpa in fifth... and I don't think I even have to say anything here; and what's even more surprising, Kyouko beat ARIA, which is absolutely stunning if you ask me, as we're talking about a popular main character. That really bodes for Madoka's characters' success. Won't say more than that because, well, preliminaries bla bla bla. --BrickBreak 21:24, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

And Mami beats Erio and Mayuri. That's just overkill. (on the other hand, Scanty didn't even made the top 40. What the hell, Japan). --BrickBreak 18:24, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

It is, and it says to everyone "Please everyone, come target us!" It might be like Saki all over again. --randomanon 18:38, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, well, we'll have at least four buffers, plus Charlotte and whatever we can get of what's left and the second preliminaries to act as distractions. I honestly wasn't expecting Sayaka to win, though (one vote difference O.o), because you wouldn't believe the amount of idiots who say "she deserved to die, the naive bitch". Of course that us foreigners, but even in Japan she seems to be unfavored (I remember a pilgrimage to the Madoka cafe where there her t-shirts were the only ones that weren't sold out). --BrickBreak 16:05, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

They're not all buffers because many voters don't go by anime when placing a vote on a girl. Some of the less popular girls won't win against a top-tier candidate from another anime. If snipers knock out Madoka and Homura, it'll become very difficult after that. Many voters don't like curves like Mami for their winning candidate and neither Kyouko nor Sayaka are that popular. Charlotte and the others won't get that far. --randomanon 23:20, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

And now for something completely different: personally, I have absolutely no understanding of Japanese. And I figure I'm not the only one int he same situation. So how about including a mini-guide on this page to help people voting (and finding other useful information on the site)? --BrickBreak 20:51, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Check the English site link. It will tell you everything. Although it seems that for prelims at least, they're blocking overseas IPs or it's incredibly difficult to get a generated code. --randomanon 21:05, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, animesaimoe.org covers it well. Since none of the IP ranges I've tested are working yet, I won't bother with "saimoe voting for dummies" instructions until the main tournament starts, but when it does there will be pictures and everything here. KM 21:17, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

And this is where my inexperience bites me again... but why the hell would they go that far? Are foreigners not worthy of reviewing "their" characters, or what? --BrickBreak 01:49, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

Saimoe errs on the side of being overly conservative and censoring at the drop of a hat if they sense any kind of vote manipulation, like proxy voting. However in this case, it probably has to do with the belief that overseas fans do not understand the definition of moe used in the tournament and are only voting based on anime or character popularity. I must say there's some truth to that. So they want to reduce influence there at least for prelimins. The belief is that overseas fans will be allowed to vote during the actual tournament rounds, which is what matters anyways. For Madoka fans, there's honestly no need to bother with the preliminaries. Main characters will have no problems making the top 12 to move on to the regular tournament rounds. --randomanon 01:58, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

Heh, that's a reason I can understand. But then again, the definition of moe isn't properly set in stone, and I'm simply not seeing the same issues (if you wanna call it that) with popularity not happening there as well. Just look at Walpurgis, it barely missed the cut, and it's going into another round of preliminaries. How on earth someone would
Changing subjects (again): think Hitomi, Kazuko and Junko (and maybe Walpurgis) will make it to the main lot? --BrickBreak 02:35, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

Saimoe is really Japan's competition and Japan's definition of moe. There's the International Saimoe which is open to all, but with proxy voting issues, not taken as seriously. Nonetheless, it's their contest to run it the way they like. As for Walpurgis, it made the second round prelims. But that's the tongue-in-cheek part I talked about...any case, none of the minor ones will last long. That's just done for amusement. They will all be eliminated when Japan starts getting serious. --randomanon 02:39, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

laughing sayaka.gif

You almost had me for a second. - Prima 23:45, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

And considering Hitomi failed the cut by one place... oh my god, so appropriate. So very appropriate. Wasn't expecting both Junko and Hitomi out, given their high standings in the first prelims. But oh well, at least we got Ume-sensei! --BrickBreak 23:53, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

Haha. Also, about the tactical voting comment, since they both did worse than before, I wonder if some people are trying to minimize the backlash by not backing the minor Madoka characters in this round. The match was close enough that only a few would have to do it, and we don't want to get a reputation like Saki. KM 00:25, 9 August 2011 (UTC)

Heh, as far as tactical votes go, we got a good distraction for now, in the form of Index's 17 chars (!) with two more on group 6. That's just insane.
Also, a random question for those watching Steins;Gate: should Ruka even be in this tourney? Because, you know... it's a guy. --BrickBreak 01:01, 9 August 2011 (UTC)

Well technically Ruka was Rukako for awhile... So i'm not sure how that works. Snsninja 04:17, 9 August 2011 (UTC)