Talk:Shinjidai no Mixture Magazine BLACK PAST

Experimenting with some more table formats:

Example 1:

Translations of interview text from online posts (now verified by scans):

When I [Uno] watched Madoka, it came upon me that I had met a presentation that updated the image of “miracle”. And I think this new image is about going deep with the “miracle” that occurred from a base of the relationship of two people of the same gender in which one side had only barely one month of sharing time with the other side, something that by conventional thinking would put as lacking ground and thus fragile. Between Homura and Madoka sex as narrowly defined could not happen and no child could be born between them. There is no ground whatsoever that would be said to be special and irreplacable. [Editor's note: "Sex as narrowly defined" is referring to Japanese law where no penetration = no sex.] However, from there a “miracle” was established. At least those who watched the show feel that. And here clearly some tricks from the power of story-telling and the fictional account were at work. And what we seek from media with high degree of imagination like anime is this kind of power of story-telling, that is, showing to us the power that can make possible something originally impossible, I think. This is precisely what is a “miracle”.

Show original text:
宇野：「まどか」を見て、久しぶりに「奇跡」のイメージを更新してくれる表現に出会ったように思いました。その新しいイメージというのは、片方にとっては一ヶ月しか時間を共有していない同性の相手との関係性という、普通に考えればあまりにも根拠が弱く脆弱なものをベースに「奇跡」が起こるということに尽きるんじゃないかと思います。まどかとほむらの間には狭義のセックスは成立しないし子どもも生まれない。それを特別なもの、入れ替え不可能なものとする根拠は何もない。 しかし、そこには「奇跡」が成立している訳ですね。少なくとも観ている人はそう感じてしまう。そこに明らかに物語の力、作り話ゆえの詐術が働いている。そして僕らがアニメのような虚構性の高い表現に求めているのはこういう物語の力、つまりは本来あり得ないものを可能にしてしまう力を見せてくれることじゃないかと思うんですね。それこそがまさに「奇跡」なわけです。

The problem with this format is where to cut the text and add the Japanese one. It wouldn't work after each line, so every couple of paragraphs?

Example 2:

Translations of interview text from online posts (now verified by scans):

Toggle original text: When I [Uno] watched Madoka, it came upon me that I had met a presentation that updated the image of “miracle”. And I think this new image is about going deep with the “miracle” that occurred from a base of the relationship of two people of the same gender in which one side had only barely one month of sharing time with the other side, something that by conventional thinking would put as lacking ground and thus fragile. Between Homura and Madoka sex as narrowly defined could not happen and no child could be born between them. There is no ground whatsoever that would be said to be special and irreplacable. [Editor's note: "Sex as narrowly defined" is referring to Japanese law where no penetration = no sex.] However, from there a “miracle” was established. At least those who watched the show feel that. And here clearly some tricks from the power of story-telling and the fictional account were at work. And what we seek from media with high degree of imagination like anime is this kind of power of story-telling, that is, showing to us the power that can make possible something originally impossible, I think. This is precisely what is a “miracle”.

宇野：「まどか」を見て、久しぶりに「奇跡」のイメージを更新してくれる表現に出会ったように思いました。その新しいイメージというのは、片方にとっては一ヶ月しか時間を共有していない同性の相手との関係性という、普通に考えればあまりにも根拠が弱く脆弱なものをベースに「奇跡」が起こるということに尽きるんじゃないかと思います。まどかとほむらの間には狭義のセックスは成立しないし子どもも生まれない。それを特別なもの、入れ替え不可能なものとする根拠は何もない。 しかし、そこには「奇跡」が成立している訳ですね。少なくとも観ている人はそう感じてしまう。そこに明らかに物語の力、作り話ゆえの詐術が働いている。そして僕らがアニメのような虚構性の高い表現に求めているのはこういう物語の力、つまりは本来あり得ないものを可能にしてしまう力を見せてくれることじゃないかと思うんですね。それこそがまさに「奇跡」なわけです。

This one is a lot messier code-wise, but it keeps the idea of having the Japanese text right next to its translation.

Thoughts/suggestions? --Knon 21:33, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

I like it. There's only going to be small number of people who can read it well enough in Japanese for it to be meaningful. But I do want to leave it there so people can see the source text if they want, especially for those sections where we don't have scans. I can also think of a few other text heavy pages where this would be useful. Oh I forgot I did something like this for SPA except it was just a collapsed separate table for the original text. I don't think that'd work for BLACK PAST because it's so long and the sections are linked to different scans/text sources. But perhaps it can be consolidated into larger sections than it is now. --randomanon 21:44, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

The Spa article was actually the inspiration for the first example. Perhaps I should have mentioned that. I just combined the collapsing part with the translation to make it look like a single piece. As for the Black Past interview, I was leaning towards the second model because it works better with longer texts. --Knon 03:17, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I think that's good. --randomanon 03:35, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

Well, if there are no problems with it, I guess I'll begin implementing it into the article. --Knon 03:51, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

And done. I'll start looking through the pages to see where else it would be useful. The 4Gamer Interview looks like it could use it. --Knon 05:45, 1 September 2011 (UTC)